Please don't implement this old league system, read my lament

Please, read this claim and lament.
1-how can we play this league mechanics on a game that takes this long to achieve the max level?

2-how people still thinking on league that make the players apart of the time and effort they made so far, and force them to start again without the most important thing in arpg games: your character and your loot.

3-why not a league or ladder where you keep what you already have and apply it to the new league content making the gameplay more rich and your character more powerful or opening new possibilities for this already owned character grown like new skills, new systems, new items.

4-if is so difficult to keep your player base active without forcing them to re level characters why instead of making a new one give us the option to reroll our existing characther keeping with it at least our loot, So we can focus on the new loot instead having to farm it all again.

4- arpg is about loot. d2 was a success because we could use the loot we find on the first day until the very last day on our characters. this league and season mechanics are a real bullshit imposed on players who will feel forced to play it for the new content. So we will gather our new beloved loot just to let it sitting on our stash forever, because when the new league or season come out we will be forced to do the same process again.
Please make it in a way we can merge what we have and what is being added to the game, so we can have a real arpg experience where you see the fruits of your time and effort spent being used for something good.

5- create a league different from what we have on Poe and d3, I bought your game for a new experience don't copy it's failure.

6- I really believe on wolcen potential, I've been playing the game over d3 and Poe, even with all bugs and problems. I don't want to go back to these games, I want to stay here. But just hearing you guys talking about this league mechanic makes me feel that I'm back to these games. I don't play 10 hours daily to let all my achievements being erased with a mechanic that make all my effort useless.

7- If the league mechanics is unavoidable, give us at least the option to access all the league content and perks with our non seasonal characters, so we can play the new content with our already owned characters.
this way people who like to restart will be pleased. And people who don't like to restart will have the option to keep playing the way they like but not being denied this new content,
this is a simple solution that will make everyone happy and won't hurt your pockets.
think on it like the ladder from d2, where you choose to restart so you can be more competitive and fair with the new players. But also keep the old players who don't want to restart happy, giving us the penalty of not figuring on the league's leaderboard.
every type of player will be free to choose what they want, and granted access to the full content of the game one way or another.

8- And for god's sake my char still 81, I don't want to make an alt. the way wolcen works make alts a dumb choice. it's unique as it is, don't ruin it.

9- Don't be naive, Leagues or Seasons aren't end game content, is just a shit way to keep the player base engaged. It's actually it's opposite since you are forcing players to restart the game. I really don't get how you can even think about this bullshit.

10-a) focus on giving us chat channels so the players can interact inside the game.
polish what you have on the game already.
b)give us a decent pvp option. like an arena wow style or even the open space out of the town like in d2, so players would spend countless hours using they earned loot trying to figure out multiple ways to kill each other and farming the loot they need to do it.
c) erase dupes and ban dupers accounts.
d) improve for real your servers. most of builds can crash the game when playing on density.
e) improve the enemies , they are way too passive and slow to respond.
f) finish and fix what you have already before thinking on doing something new.
g) and maybe think twice on the item quality upgtade patch you did. if we can't upgrade legendaries what is the point on dropping legendary loot with no perfect quality.

Please think on what I'm saying. If you guys really love arpgs and loot, don't betray people like me who would play this game for years and years if you guys give us only a little of love and stop treating us like idiots, Think over this shell called league or season, make it your own way doing it so you can keep you player base active but not throwing all effort we already made away.

I'm really happy to hear we will have news, improvements, fixings and content but this story of league mechanics make me so sad that for the first time I'm thinking in stop playing wolcen.

Replies: 8

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

Category: Community

Diablo seasons are just power creeps with exactly the same content, they get old really quick. PoE leagues on the other hand are exciting because there's always new mechanics. However, those mechanics would get boring much faster if you didn't have to start a new character.

As you said, ARPG is all about loot, but the only way to get you interested in new mechanics without reseting your character is giving you much better loot than what you already have, which is the definition of power creep. 3 leagues later there would have to be items with 500 attributes and 200% damage just because they have to be better what you already have.

This also means that old content will get either obsolete or they have to retune them but that means if you skip a leagues then you won't be able to do content you could because the content is no longer tuned to your gear level.

Having to start again in a new league is the lesser evil in my opinion.

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

Why the same idea as POE ? I dont play POE because im casual player i dont have so much time to play , and another game that i found will implement the same game content.Its really bad ,another game only for no lives . If the season finish i will get first max lvl and i need to start again-

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

This

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

So your opinion is that Wolcen should only go after the casual market?

Lets count to 10:

1 - Fair point. Easily fixed with a rebalancing of the xp curve when leagues arrive.

2 - Economy resets are necessary in ARPGs that involve trading. Your loot and character will be just fine outside of the league, play it all you want.

3 - Same answer as 2 above.

4 - This comment hurt my head. Let us keep our loot and characters in leagues so that we can focus on new loot? I think that's what you're asking for anyways. Same answer as 2 above. You can't reset the economy AND let people bring in assets from the old economy. This is common sense?

4 (4 again???) - ARPGs are about loot, yes. D2 wasn't a big success because of the absence of seasons. Quite to the contrary, ladder seasons were a big part of D2's success. No one is going to force you to play new content. If you're a non-league player, maybe play with and make some non-league friends. Unless your concern is that most people will want to play in leagues, which is probably true.

5 - I'm sure they will create their own style of league. I find your assessment of D3 and POE as failures might be off the mark a little bit. Ok, maybe not as off the mark with D3. ;P

6- I believe in Wolcen's potential too. Enough so that I'm taking my time to make this response instead of playing POE or Wolcen. No one is going to erase your gear or characters. They'll be safe and sound in the non-league environment, which is clearly your preference. So ... just ... play ... non-league?

7 - I'd say this is something for the Wolcen devs to legit think about.

8 - Insert random tangent about alts? What does leagues have to do with making alts? I'll guess you mean your seasonal/league main is your alt. Play non-league if you're dead against making a new character every few months?

9 - Woah. Easy there. xD You ran out of points a while ago and are just holding back tears at this point (or not). Take a breather. Leagues aren't a "shit mechanic to keep players engaged". The fact that it keeps the players engaged is the point. It's fun. If it were shit, players wouldn't be engaged, and no one would do it.

Random Tangent Lightning round:

10a - Yes please.
10b - I'm not a PVPer but sure, why not! Make PVP Great Again.
10c - Yes!
10d - Yes!
10e - Don't see the problem here. Signaling in this game is brilliant.
10f - Yes. Though don't let this stop you from communicating future plans with the player base.
10g - That was a bug, it was fixed in today's patch.



So in summary:

points 1 - 9: Play non-league if you don't want to play league. Leagues are and have always been optional content. Let others make that choice for themselves rather than trying to pigeonhole EVERYONE else into playing the way you want to play.

point 10: Had nothing to do with rest of post but all good points here.

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

So your opinion is that Wolcen should only go after the casual market?

Lets count to 10:

1 - Fair point. Easily fixed with a rebalancing of the xp curve when leagues arrive.

2 - Economy resets are necessary in ARPGs that involve trading. Your loot and character will be just fine outside of the league, play it all you want.

3 - Same answer as 2 above.

4 - This comment hurt my head. Let us keep our loot and characters in leagues so that we can focus on new loot? I think that's what you're asking for anyways. Same answer as 2 above. You can't reset the economy AND let people bring in assets from the old economy. This is common sense?

4 (4 again???) - ARPGs are about loot, yes. D2 wasn't a big success because of the absence of seasons. Quite to the contrary, ladder seasons were a big part of D2's success. No one is going to force you to play new content. If you're a non-league player, maybe play with and make some non-league friends. Unless your concern is that most people will want to play in leagues, which is probably true.

5 - I'm sure they will create their own style of league. I find your assessment of D3 and POE as failures might be off the mark a little bit. Ok, maybe not as off the mark with D3. ;P

6- I believe in Wolcen's potential too. Enough so that I'm taking my time to make this response instead of playing POE or Wolcen. No one is going to erase your gear or characters. They'll be safe and sound in the non-league environment, which is c…

trulain Original Comment

Casual palyers are the ones that should benefit the most from leagues since it's a restart.
And why are you losing your time typing here if you're not a dev? My post is addressed to the Wolcen devs.

You're free to ask for them what you think is fair.

And if you like to reroll and play the same shit again forever instead of improving something that you already have, well, ces't la vie, you do whatever you want with your time.

You're just missing the point, I don't really care about Leagues, what I dislike is to experience and get the new content you're forced to play it. I want to experience the new content on the standard mode, and I'll be glad to be apart from the players in Leagues, while doing my own thing.

And maybe if one day they implement a rank system exclusive to leagues I would join it for the competitive apeal to figure on those leaderboards. But that's a maybe.

D3 has Seasons and POE has leagues... i'm playing wolcen for something new, if I was looking only for a copy why should I bother with so many bugs and problems, since I already own d3 and poe?

So if you don't get it yet, let me try make it crystal clear: ARPGS are about loot and character tunning. When you are forced to forget your project to go start a new one just because devs need keep their palyer base engaged, that's just foolish and sad.

Leagues are fine for people who want to compete with others in fair terms.

But new content don't need to be implemented only through Leagues, you can have the new content for everyone and give the choice for the players to decide if they want to roll a new character to experience it or not.

(Edited 2 years, 6 months ago)

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

Be wise. Implement it but very different from poe and d3 way. Poe and d3 added infinite leveling scale with no infinite gear progress. So scale infinite progress according to level to drop better gear. What to do ?

  • When players hit level 60 it opens a new fate of wheel circle (offer this new circle just in league - when player left league the circle also vanish or keep it after). This new circle is not based on point its based on city project level - each point earned will depend on stormfall structure projects level. Some projects finished will give points (1~5).

  • Create one project where after complete it you allow potion to be dropped with 2 random affixes (so a lot of combination will be possible).

  • You want to make a 4th act. Make this city from 4th act be neighbor from stormfall. And on this city all projects are independent and they level splitted with new projects and progress to achieve.

  • When mage hits level 60-70 the willpower always miss. So add some projects on this new city to achieve +30% willpower conversion rate from rage.

  • When player hits level 75-90 the power progress sensation is much slow from the rest of the game. You play more and a lot and you don't feel enough reward for playing it. When player hits level 75 create the wheel of fate recast project - when player complete it -> earn 1 fate of wheel recast point - This point just can be used above one already opened wheel of fate point so after using the effect will be doubled (can't use on special points) - and the color change to orange.

  • Like players said all ammorpg games should be based on gear progress. So after level 60 boost gear affixes based on level. Example level 61 boost 10 points on ferocity/wisdom/agility etc. Level 62 boost 20 etc.. And each 5 level from level 60 boost beyond attributes affixes the other affixs amount spell damage amount etc.

  • Skill specialization feature - after player hits level 80 allow it to run a lot of projects to improve skills - this way a lot of expedion and fun will be warranted.

  • Add limit to repeat daily quest with ingredients rewards to upgrade gear. Allow just to repeat 10 times so it reward 10 ingredients quest daily so players on end game will play at leat 10 expedition per day to get ingredients to upgrade their gear. Low levels also can run it but they will get lower specification ingredient.
    (Why quest on ammorpg ? - This way all players can get some evolution - casual/addicts. And bots won't benefit to play 24h when 1-3h warranty these rewards. Addict player can evolve the other stuff. You could to consider to add some passive skills where we evolve it by accomplishing some daily quests - this way you achieve a daily basis player - same the not addicted - logging it everyday to get them).

If you apply all of it your league will be a sucess.

(Edited 2 years, 6 months ago)

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

Like others stated already with good arguments. Do not go the direction of leagues. The working man with a family (me including) dont want to and aint willing to start over every 2-3-4-5 months. Rather just release new skins/content where we can use our already made heroes and I will happily pay for that.

Dont go the direction of Poe or D3. A normal person with a normal life dont have time to restart and learn all new things like in Poe. Its simply WAY to much content to fast.

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

They have to work on both league and non league. D3 and poe just work on season/league. Non league/season are left behind.

Just work on both. So you will have both player gender playing your game addicted/casual.

Created: 2 years, 6 months ago

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