32h+ testing builds feedback and suggestions.

Hello guys, first of all i love this game, really good job, thanks for it!
I was testing many builds in end game and most of them are balanced but...
1. Turret skill need to be reworked, really its insane how u can run around, drop turret instantly with way too low cooldown and wait few secs to kill bosses with 10+ lvls than u. Here are my suggestions:
Make it auto-targeting without mods, but it should have lower range, attack speed and dmg. More cooldown and maybe something like casting time for builing it. Maybe it should be targetable by mobs too.
After these changes u have alot of modification ideas:
- More range (4pts).
- More attack speed (4pts).
- Faster turning around speed (4pts).
- More cooldown but u can hold 2 stacks of it, and drop both of them without cooldown (4pts).
- Small radius area around the turret where u and allies get 20%(?) resists (4pts).
- Flame Thrower: Change dmg into fire, lower range but its aoe. Deal more dmg (8pts).
- Poison Dart Thrower: Change dmg into toxic, lower dmg but shoots faster (8pts).
- Second Cannon: Add second projectile (8pts).
Seriously when i changed my skills to auto-turret build, game looks like broken.
2. Skills for shield (like catalyst).
Shield should be requirment for skills too. It would be nice to have some support skills for it like healing Bulwark and just dashing, stunning and blocking stuff. Here some suggestions:
- War Path should be shield skill.
- Summon big shield in front of u to block 75-100% dmg from projectiles. U can walk with it, but u cant attack and when u use other skills this one is disabled.(u can use to block dmg on bosses for u and ur allies). Mods for it: block more dmg, make shield wider, walk faster with it, when shield is up u can use dash attack for jump to ur ally, u are generating rage for every projectile blocked.
- Throw shield to deal dmg and stun target. Mods: deal less dmg but it can bounce between enemies, throw it on ally to give him barrier for few secs, change dmg to sacred and pierce enemies, add slow effect after stun.
3. There is no place for long combo animation skills in end game.They looks nice ofcourse but gameplay in end game is really dynamic so u cant stay in place to use those skills.

Replies: 5

Created: 2 months, 1 week ago

Category: Feedback & Suggestions

Thank you very much for taking the time to share your thoughts Valdiniss :) All of this will be different at the release and more skills will be available. We initially considered Warpath as a shield skill but we finally decided to make it available for every melee character. That might change at the release though.

Created: 2 months, 1 week ago

I agree with allot of this. except changing warpath. As long as there's other melee skills that we will be able to substitute for warpaththen it's OK to switch it to shield only, but right now it's one of our heaviest hitting melee skills and allows us to stay out of the fire. Melee is in bad shape right now, anything other then a shield build suffers quite a bit end game. So eliminating DW or 2h's only real option to clear large amounts of mobs and avoid extra damage isn't a good idea


There is also way too many skills that aren't usable simply due to taking time. either skills need to be faster, or mob difficulty needs to be adjusted so we can actually survive long enough to cast said skills. personally, I like the skill interactions and animations, it would be a shame to lose those just because bosses move too fast.

On the same note, too many instant skills simply do too much damage. As an example, Thunderstrike does almost as much damage as havoc orb, yet has greater range, greater spread, and instantly hits the target (even auto targets if your close). Havoc Orb has a cast time, slow projectile travel speed, and has a much narrower radius of damage potential. To get it big enough to hit enough mobs to count, you need to reduce it's damage even more. Skills like Havoc should honestly hit like a truck since your chances of hitting with them are drastically lower.

Melee needs some serious love. right now the only thing that is really competitive is ranged classes or damage soak tanks. D3 ran into this issue as well, and their solution was a simple global damage reduction across the board for melee classes, like around 35% or so. Not sure how you could envelop that in a game like this were there isn't any classes, but the same thing in principly needs to happen. Melee simply have to soak up too much damage to deal their damage, and there's NO benefit for taking that risk. Perhaps if melee did a huge amount more then ranged, but then you run into more balance issues. So not sure what the best solution is, but needs to happen

I love this game's design and direction so far (got 135 hours clocked already and still playing) , but the balance has me worried. I figure your already looking into allot of this stuff, But I just wanted to make sure it was noted.

(Edited 2 months, 1 week ago)

Created: 2 months, 1 week ago

Nice to see your replies! I really love how devs looks at the game and players. Great job, cant wait for release,

Thing with melee playstyle its really hard to balance when everyone can have heavy armors, tanky passives, etc. When i fight bosses i feel like its easier to be melee cuz u can see every move and u have time to react but maybe its only me :D Maybe the key its in melee skills, make it stronger so we can be more tanky without losing all damage output or we can choose risky gameplay to deal more dmg than ranged classes but at the cost of being close to enemies.

Created: 2 months ago

Nice to see your replies! I really love how devs looks at the game and players. Great job, cant wait for release,

Thing with melee playstyle its really hard to balance when everyone can have heavy armors, tanky passives, etc. When i fight bosses i feel like its easier to be melee cuz u can see every move and u have time to react but maybe its only me :D Maybe the key its in melee skills, make it stronger so we can be more tanky without losing all damage output or we can choose risky gameplay to deal more dmg than ranged classes but at the cost of being close to enemies.

Valdiniss Original Comment

I agree with you. It's probably tough to balance out all the finer points when there's so much flexibility in the current system. I certainly commend the dev's on putting together a comprehensive system like this and making it work as well as it currently does.

Perhaps one of the challenges is the extreme damage output. When bosses one shot you, it's tough to be able to have time to respond to them w/o paying a heavy price. Even with my decently geared warpath build. boss damage is just too much to get past certain levels. One mistake and your toast. I think that if they lowered the overall spike damage it would help allot. I have a soak tank that can do higher tiers stuff, but he kills as slow as molasses in january. But I think this key to survival is his high health pool and regen, which allows him to take a few of those heavy hits and survive long enough for the life leech to tick.

So I think perhaps a better balance of health vs. mob damage would provide better windows of time to see and respond appropriately. with the current tree you just can't get enough health and defenses to get past that 1 shot point w/o sacrificing most of your damage and becoming a tank. Perhaps the key is in the full tree on release. But it's always good to have important feedback about the current state. I'd hate to see this game launch only to find out that you can't do endgame unless your carrying a shield or Kiting the bosses with auto-win turret.

Created: 2 months ago

"1. Turret skill need to be reworked, really its insane how u can run around, drop turret instantly with way too low cooldown and wait few secs to kill bosses with 10+ lvls than u. Here are my suggestions:
Make it auto-targeting without mods, but it should have lower range, attack speed and dmg. More cooldown and maybe something like casting time for builing it. Maybe it should be targetable by mobs too."

Some problems here:
1) Lower range - In order to do that, they would need to nerf the range of some bosses as well, other wise, turrets would be too weak.
2) Casting time for building it - Most of the skills for ranged builds have an insane delay, bow like skills, so increasing the cast time would, again, make turrets weak.
3) Able to be target by mobs - That's not a bet idea but to do that properly, turrets should have some mod that could increase life or drop aggro at dps cost, otherwise, again, turrets would be too weak.

A turret that takes more time to build + less range than bosses (while they can hit you in a screen distance) + able to be destroyed by mobs = useless in such a fast game.

Created: 1 week, 6 days ago

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